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AVOIDING TOURISTS & LONELY PLANET GUIDE SUGGESTIONS

  • VictoriaT

    Joined Travelfish
    7th June, 2012
    Posts: 6

    okay so I know it is impossible to avoid tourists but I'm sure a travelfisher can help me with the following:

    I will be in SE Asia (Thailand, Laos, Vietnam) and need some help avoiding tourist traps or areas filled with tourists. Not to offend anyone but especially the islands as I have been there and find them filled with Europeans/Americans looking for cheap sex and booze). To be more specific, I am aware that while staying at a hotel I will certainly be in a tourist area but I am interested in venturing out of the common tourist path completely. I have been to SE Asia many times and somehow always get stuck in tourist areas.

    I want to only eat in street vendors, wander in places where no one speaks English, and stumble upon quaint tea houses, small markets, etc.

    To be much more specific:

    1. Where can I find the best street food/area in Bangkok?
    2. What areas of Thailand can I visit that are off the typical tourist track (Not Chaing Mai, Phi Phi etc.) and how do I get there?
    3. Any additional recommendations for really getting a true feel for Asian culture? More specifically Northern Thailand and Vietnam.
    4. Lunag Prabang sounds really interesting but I think it may be bit to "overdone". What do you think?

    Your suggestions and help is greatly appreciated. I leave in six weeks.

    #1 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 09:59

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  • Tilapia

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    Hi Victoria,

    1. Good street food is everywhere in Bangkok, but there are some areas that are highly regarded by Thais and see few tourists. One is Sao Chingcha (http://importfood.com/saochingcha_guide.html) which is close to the Royal Palace and Wat Suthat. Not many people go into this area despite it's proximity to Banglamphu and the KSR area. Here's a map ... http://importfood.com/media/saochingcha_foodmap_2007-1.jpg ... There are lots of food carts and open-walled restaurants. Fantastic, inexpensive food, and many dishes that aren't seen very often. Another great area is Talad Nang Loeng at the corner of Thanon Nakhon Sawan and Thanon Krun Kasem. It's not a large market but it's a busy one ... it's wildly popular but not with tourists. It's about a 45 minute walk from KSR, and worth every step. Here are a few links ...


    http://www.cnngo.com/bangkok/eat/khao-khluk-kapi-567598
    http://www.bangkokpost.com/travel/local-destinations/listing/nang-loeng-market/20637/
    http://www.thetrippacker.com/en/destination/place/attraction/bangkok-nang-loeng-market


    Don't expect to see or hear much English in either area.


    This is a great site for Bangkok food. It covers most of the bases and even shows you on a map where to find every place that's written about ... www.eatingthaifood.com


    2. A great area that's not part of the "beaten track" is, pretty much, the entire length of the Mekong River from Chiang Khan down to Khong Chiam. In other words, Issan or the Northeast. How do you get there? Depends on which direction you want to travel in. Bus to Loei and then songthaew to Chiang Khan ... bus or night train from Bangkok to Nong Khai ... bus or night train from Bangkok to Ubon Ratchathani. Buses, songthaews and pick-ups get you around in those areas and all along the river. Lots of fantastic people, nice small towns, great food, beautiful scenery, laid back pace, scant few tourists, and pretty inexpensive. I think the best way to do this area is on two wheels ... bicycle or motorbike (cheap to rent).


    Sangkhlaburi is quite good, but not during weekends or holidays. Most people don't go beyond Kanchanaburi.


    The area around Sukhothai over to the Burmese border and north.


    The area around Dan Sai.


    Frankly, most of the country is off the beaten track. If you know where the "track" is, don't travel on it. Buses go everywhere in the country and will take you anywhere you think you might like to see. Nearly every town will have somewhere to stay even if there's not much to see or do besides eat and watch what goes on there.



    3. Not sure how to answer this as everyone seems to have their own idea of what Asian culture means. As far as I'm concerned, when you're there you're surrounded by it, even if you don't like what you see or if it doesn't conform to any pre-conceived notions. If you want to see how Thai families live, you might want to consider doing a homestay or two. Or hanging out in a town for a bit and asking if you can speak to a few classes in the local school. This is very easy and a great way to meet people. Guest house owners can be very helpful when it comes to this sort of thing. Meet Thai people and many doors will open for you.

    4. Luang Prabang is an amazing city in a gorgeous area. It's popular for very good reasons. It is also a UNESCO Heritage Site, which means that development is strictly controlled. This doesn't slow down the flood of tourists that come to see the place, though. I doubt you'll find many people who have been there, even those who hate being amongst hoards of tourists, who would regret going or who wouldn't recommend the place.


    Sorry about all the characters in brackets and bad spacing.

    #2 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:00

  • DLuek

    TF writer
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    Good street food is everywhere in Bangkok. Banglamphu (at least away from Khao San) and China Town (Yaowarat) are known for it, but it's truly everywhere. So many streets have great street food - by day the area around Victory Monument comes to mind, and by night both Charoen Krung (near the river and BTS Saphan Taksin) and Charoen Nakhon (on the other side of the river near BTS Krung Thonburi) are lined with great street food stalls.

    As for areas in Bangkok, I personally love Thonburi, although it takes some time to really explore it. A couple ways to start are by a) going to Wat Arun, walking to the neighborhood behind it, and just keep walking, trying street food and enjoying the little alleys and canals as you go, or b) take an express boat to Wang Long (aka Phran Nok) pier and walk for a ways on Thanon Phran Nok - a few colorful wet markets and plenty of good local food and culture around there.

    Other good areas in Bangkok for a real "local" vibe away from the tourists are Din Daeng, Huay Khwang, Lat Phrao, Ramkamhaeng, and Bang Kapi (all east and northeast of the city). If wanting to avoid tourists just steer clear of Silom/Sathorn, Sukhumvit, Khao San, and of course the big sights along the Chao Phraya River.

    Areas in Thailand off the tourist track? Go to Isaan. Try cities like Nakhon Ratchasima, Khon Kaen, Buriram, Ubon Ratchathani, and Mukhadan (I've yet to go here but Madmac has a lot of good to say about it anyway). All of these are good spots for getting a feel for northeastern Thai life and there are lots of day trips outside of them. For one, I recommend the little temple town of Phimai - some haunting Khmer ruins are there but it's also a sleepy little country town with a good night market.

    As for northern Thailand, you might give Lamphun and/or Lampang a try... Both quiet towns with a lot of history but nowhere near as many tourists as Chiang Mai. In southern Thailand, I love Trang. Of course there are great islands that can be accessed from there, but the city itself is a good place to enjoy local culture - great southern food, local style coffee (kopi), good night market, good day trips to nearby waterfalls, etc. Phang Nga is also a good small southern Thai town for a bit of culture, good food, and great day trips.

    In Vietnam, it's a bit more of a challenge to get off the tourist trail but it is doable. Explore Saigon's and Hanoi's back streets. Da Nang is also a good smaller city. A few years back, I rented a motorbike in Hoi An and just rode out into the country everyday... Hoi An itself is super touristy but just outside is some great country life and beautiful scenery in every direction.

    How do you get there? In all cases, go to the bus or train station, buy a ticket, and hop on. That's the easy part. Motorbikes can be rented in most if not all of those destinations too.

    I still haven't made it to LP.

    I'm curious about your statement that you want to avoid "the islands as I have been there and find them filled with Europeans/Americans looking for cheap sex and booze". What islands are you talking about? It sounds like Patong or Kata in Phuket to me... Anyway, there are many Thai islands that are very peaceful, not very touristy and nothing like what you describe. Try Ko Bulon Lae, Ko Sukorn, Ko Libong, or Ko Phra Thong. The national park islands (Ko Tarutao, Ko Adang, Ko Surin, Ko Similan, Ko Ra) are also great if you enjoy stunning natural scenery, hiking and such.

    #3 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:02

  • lulubay007

    Joined Travelfish
    27th June, 2012
    Posts: 1

    try koh samet........u will find locals as majority

    #4 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:09

  • DLuek

    TF writer
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    Oh yeah, also avoid Siam Square area if avoiding tourists in Bangkok. And, Phra Phradaeng (the area just southwest of Bangkok that the Chao Phraya river wraps around) is a great place to enjoy some countryside and an amazingly rural atmosphere right in the shadow of Bangkok. There are some homestays and a good local weekend market there too.

    #5 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:35

  • VictoriaT

    Joined Travelfish
    7th June, 2012
    Posts: 6

    First of all thank you for the great suggestions and reference sites. I will actually print this message board and take with me on my travels.

    Tilapia
    Thanks for providing me with actual names as I will definitely visit many of them. I think I will try Luang Proabang if it as pretty as everyone says. Perhaps we can take a motorcycle out of LP. Is is possible to rent one in LP?
    What is a great Elephant Conservation Camp in Laos?

    DLuek:

    Thanks. Yes, I have been the the typical phuket, phi phi, koh samui, etc. I actually did not think their where areas in the South that were still "pure" with natural beauty so perhaps we will just make our way south.

    #6 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:40

  • Tilapia

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    Hey Victoria,

    The Eating Thai Food site has a great document called $1 Thai Meals. I think that all you have to do is subscribe to their feed (pardon the pun), which is quite good, and you will get to download the document. There are 50 different dishes and every one of them has a photo, ingredients, the name in English and Thai as well as pronunciation, and the author's favourite place for eating said dish. It's all street food.

    Not sure about renting motorbikes in or around LP. I was speaking of renting in Thailand and exploring the Mekong. You can rent in Nong Khai, for example, and then take off. The road along the Mekong has light traffic and is amazing for riding on. Better than taking the bus, but the bus is still good.

    Can't help you with elephant info, either. Sorry.

    #7 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 11:49

  • VictoriaT

    Joined Travelfish
    7th June, 2012
    Posts: 6

    Love the idea of taking the bike up the Mekong. Can I leave it in the North when I'm done or do you know if I must return it in Nong Khai?

    #8 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 12:49

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    A route I recommend to the adventurous is to take the train to Ubon Ratchathani and then head to Khong Chiam where the Mekong and Mun rivers come together. There is a pricey but very cool resort there. Worth a day or two for chilling.

    Then head to Khemmerat. An old town, somewhat small but pleasant sitting on the Mekong. Spend a night or two kicking around there then head up to Chanuman. Chanuman and Don Tan are close together. Don Tan is, in my opinion, somewhat nicer, but these are very small districts and very slow places. You'll probably be ready to move on the next day.

    Mukdahan is next on the list. This is where I live, so if you come out here look me up. I've entertained a few travelfishers in my time here. This is a great little city with plenty to do and see. Guide books describe it as "sleepy", which it was 20 years ago. Lonely Planet is still way behind the power curve on this place.

    From here you can head up to That Phanom. One of the oldest Temples in Thailand, a beautiful, well maintained, large temple with a ton of history. One of the most important temples in the country and probably the most important in Issan. Lots of Thai tourists, but very few others.

    From there head on up to NKP. Great little city with fun nightlife. Ho Chi Minh (the bastard) used to live here, and his little house is now a museum. Air America flew out of here too, and the airfield just outside of town is now a commercial field.

    After that it's a pretty long bus ride along the river to Bung Kun, which is a small provincial capital that used to be part of Nong Khai. Worth a night though. More if you end up liking it's pace.

    From there over to Nong Khai, which has a lot going for it and is a popular backpackers destination for those crossing into Laos (you can also cross into Laos at Mukdahan and NKP as well as down south by Paxse). I would recommend pressing on to Loei if you like nature. My son was there and raved about it, and the photos looked impressive. Clean water you can actually enter without leaving a muddy slime on you!

    My thoughts for what they're worth. I love Issan, which is where I chose to retire to. BUT, work on your Thai, because if you only speak English, out here sometimes that won't cut it.

    As for this subject though: Not to offend anyone but especially the islands as I have been there and find them filled with Europeans/Americans looking for cheap sex and booze). Tourists in this category are engaging in quintessential Thai culture. Thai men love cheap sex and booze and it's everywhere in Thailand. I live in a very provincial place, and the only way you don't notice it is if you don't go out at all at night. I get propositioned routinely, and Brad Pitt I'm not. My suspicion is that most tourists who come out here don't notice it. They see an older guy with a younger, attractive Thai woman and assume it's his daughter, not his Mia Noi. For me, it's very in your face, but it doesn't bother me. I just ignore it. Thai guys in public though avoid the pawing nonsense, and tend to dress better than tourists do, so in that sense it's not so crass (unless you go to a Karaoke place - another very Thai thing - there it is often full on with girls being groped and men very drunk). Just an FYI thing. The sex industry in Thailand is a very organic part of Thai culture and has been for well over 150 years.

    #9 Posted: 28/6/2012 - 14:11

  • tezza

    Joined Travelfish
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    Posts: 1304
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    I'm an island nerd so can only help there:
    The most off the beaten track islands I've visited that have access to local island culture and are attractive islands as well are Ko Kho Khao and adjacent Ko Phra Thong about 130km north of Phuket. Each island has some inexpensive accommodation and Phra Thong has a village home-stay program which puts visitors right into the local lifestyle.
    To get to Phra Thong I'd make my way to Kuraburi north of Khao Lak, call in at one of the small travel agents at the bus stop or in the nearby main street and arrange transfers etc. Tom and Am have a desk at the bus stop and if shut their agency is directly across the main road from the short side street down from the bus station.
    KKK is easiest organised from Takua Pa about 30km south.

    Similar islands except a bit more tourist orientated are Kos Yao Yai, Yao Noi, Jum. Libong, little Chang Andaman side, Ko Kut, maybe Ko Bulon Lae.
    Yao Yai and Noi are easiest to access, each a very short ferry ride off Phuket.

    And hey, the most authentic island stay I've done was on the Sea Gypsy fishing village on piers on Phang Nga Bay where my overnight stay last year cost me a whole 250baht with food. One night is enough though. You can organise this from Phang Nga town (travel agents at bus stop - look for Mr Kean) or from any travel desk on Phuket. Best to combine with a prior tour of fantastic Phang Nga Bay, the most scenic landscape/seascape I've seen in Thailand.

    #10 Posted: 29/6/2012 - 01:58

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  • Captain_Bob

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    "What areas of Thailand can I visit that are off the typical tourist track (Not Chaing Mai, Phi Phi etc.)"

    Oh please don't put these two places in the same basket. Phi Phi is of course unavoidably touristy given it's confined space and huge popularity, except for maybe some of the tiny beaches way up north accessible by boat only.

    Chiang Mai , meanwhile, does get a lot of tourists, but only in certain areas in the old city, out by the night bazaar, in the two shopping malls, and you will find quite a few up in the Mae Sa Valley due to the presence of the Tiger Kingdom, bungy jump, elephant camps, etc. However all it takes is the slightest effort getting out of these areas and suddenly you're the only non-Thai around. Just 15km north of the city where I own land and my wife's family has their village and rice fields by all accounts you might as well be in the most remote corner of Isaan. Or throw a mountain bike in the back of a red truck to the top of Doi Pui and you can spend the whole day riding trails with no one around except a few Hmong hilltribe folks. Etc. etc. You don't have to run far far away from Chiang Mai to be totally devoid of tourists (except for you) and anything to do with tourism. It cracks me up how people sit in bars in the middle of Thaphae Gate complaining how touristy the place is. Go 20 minutes in the right direction and you'll be back in time, the only white devil in sight. And no, hardly anyone will speak passable English.

    #11 Posted: 29/6/2012 - 09:52

  • sayadian

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    Is there anywhere in Thailand you can't get good street food? Also taking up what Madmac says Mae Nam Moon has some great swimming.Southern Isan is a great place to get off the 'beaten track' nicest people in Thailand.I so miss Thai street food as the stuff they serve in Cambodia is inedible,fly-blown and tasteless.

    #12 Posted: 30/6/2012 - 01:43

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    "Is there anywhere in Thailand you can't get good street food?"

    I think the phrase "good street food" is oxymoronic.

    #13 Posted: 30/6/2012 - 06:38

  • altmtl

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    I travelled off the beaten path my last visit, it's really quite easy :)

    #14 Posted: 30/6/2012 - 12:50

  • VictoriaT

    Joined Travelfish
    7th June, 2012
    Posts: 6

    Madmac: Thanks for taking the time to provide me this itinerary. I will certainly print your post and bring with me. What is the name of the "pricey but very cool resort" in Khong Chai?

    As for Sex and Thai culture. I think it is very interesting how you put it. Perhaps I was a little turned off when I saw western men with young thai women and as an American (where sex is still very much taboo in our culture) I definetly was astonished. Thanks for enlightening me on the true meaning behind my stereotype.

    Captian_Bob: Thanks for your suggestions. I actually love Chaing Mai. I have been the Thailand twice now and always go there first. But again, I seem to have trouble getting out of the main area. I have a couple of questions for you:

    1. If I have a motorbike which direction to I go in to see these great bike trails you mention?
    2. What area should I ask for when getting directions?


    Thanks again for all your assistance. This has definetly broaden my knowledge on places I can go (even in the islands) and avoid the party scene. Looks like I will not be picking up any guide book. :)

    #15 Posted: 1/7/2012 - 07:40

  • DLuek

    TF writer
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    "...as an American (where sex is still very much taboo in our culture)"

    Sex is taboo in our culture? Where are you from, Amish country?

    Actually, Thai society is still more conservative and traditional than American society when it comes to this. Public displays of affection are strongly frowned upon even in Bangkok, as is couples living/sleeping together before marriage.

    Of course, in places like Pattaya and Patong, all of that is out the window.

    #16 Posted: 1/7/2012 - 10:45

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    "Actually, Thai society is still more conservative and traditional than American society when it comes to this. Public displays of affection are strongly frowned upon even in Bangkok, as is couples living/sleeping together before marriage."

    DLuek I would not overstate this. Couples here almost always sleep together long before they get married. In my wife's villlage most of the high school girls are sexually active (and the boys of course). There is far less public displays of affection, but there is just as much sex going on as in the US. Probably more. Thai society is very promiscuous. And there is FAR more prostitution in Thailand than back in the US.

    #17 Posted: 1/7/2012 - 11:46

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
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    Posts: 1557

    Madmac
    I'd be interested to know how many couples actually registered at the Ampere as opposed to a quick ceremony at the Wat.I think most don't bother with the official document?
    Can you give a ball park figure?

    #18 Posted: 1/7/2012 - 21:03

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    I dont' know statistically speaking. Of my friends here, I only know one couple that did not register at the Ampur. Everyone else is legally married.

    Living together isn't very common where I live, but having sex with your boyfriend / girlfriend is not just normal, it is what everyone does. It's the expected thing. If you introduce someone as your "fan" it is just assumed that couple is having sex.

    #19 Posted: 1/7/2012 - 22:39

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    Samkallis - as cool as Phuket might be, somehow I just don't think you are going to make the arguement it's "off the beaten path".

    #20 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 03:55

  • Captain_Bob

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    Captian_Bob: Thanks for your suggestions. I actually love Chaing Mai. I have been the Thailand twice now and always go there first. But again, I seem to have trouble getting out of the main area.

    Not sure why it's difficult - plenty of tuk tuks and songthaews that will take you where you want to go, or rent a bike and do it yourself. Maybe it's more of a matter of distraction, with all those guesthouses, backpackers, restaurants, etc. in the centre it can be hard to ignore, but getting away from it is the first step. I live smack in the middle of the old city surrounded by all that stuff (I have a guesthouse, travel desk and cafe catering to mostly backpackers) which makes it all the better to occasionally take a bike and get away.

    If I have a motorbike which direction to I go in to see these great bike trails you mention?

    An easy day out if you have a decent bike and riding experience, is go out the NW corner of the old city towards the zoo then turn right on the canal road. Follow it about 10km and turn left to Huay Tung Tao (lake). Ride around and past the lake where the pavement ends and keep going on the dirt path in the direction of the Doi Pui summit. You'll get to a boom gate which is usually open (it's Army land but you're OK to use it) then you have a nice trail ride up to the top, which takes about 1-2 hours depending on your pace. Eventually you pass Ban Chang Khian Hmong village, a coffee plantation (with tasting and botanical gardens), the Doi Pui campground, some viewpoints, and eventually the sealed road that leads down to Wat Doi Suthep and back to the city. I do this daytrip several times a year when I just need a breather. Also can do it in reverse with a mountain bike. Ride to the Zoo entrance, shove your bike in a red truck and get a lift up the mountain, then ride down the trails to Huay Tung Tao and back into town.

    There's also a good day ride around the "Samoeng Loop". Go north of CM to Mae Rim then turn left where the signs point to Samoeng (same turnoff for the Tiger Kingdom) go past the X-Centre, the crocodile/monkey/snake shows and keep going past the elephant camp, waterfall, etc. and soon it gets lonely but the riding is excellent. Eventually you get to Samoeng, turnoff there for some noodles. There are a few guesthouses in Samoeng but they are tiny and you could easily be the only foreigner in town. There are lots of good "nowhere" roads out there too but the main one loops around to the highway south of CM and back into town.

    Look at some GT-Rider maps which I sell as do many book shops in town. Come see me if you want more tips on where to go. Ginny Cafe on Ratchapakinai Road. See ya.

    #21 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 06:40

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    Bob I've got to get up there man.

    #22 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 08:06

  • altmtl

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    I agree with DLuek -

    "...as an American (where sex is still very much taboo in our culture)"
    Sex is taboo in our culture? Where are you from, Amish country?
    Actually, Thai society is still more conservative and traditional than American society when it comes to this. Public displays of affection are strongly frowned upon even in Bangkok, as is couples living/sleeping together before marriage.

    The US is has a huge sex trade industry and has a very vibrant porn scene, This is why a lot of cultures view American women as "easy" - The media in the US is loaded with sexism.

    Have you never heard of these guys... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Man/Boy_Love_Association

    #23 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 10:57

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    Well I've lived in both places, and I find that Thailand is certainly a lot more of a promiscuous society. But having said that, that doesn't mean Americans are puritans by any means. It's just a relative thing.

    #24 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 13:09

  • busylizzy

    Joined Travelfish
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    Maybe it's just the people you hang out with, Mac! :-P

    #25 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 14:45

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
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    Possible, but I don't think so Liz. I hang out with a pretty varied group. The Thai chess guys, my dance group, a few expats, the friends of my Thai language teacher. And my wife's family of course.

    #26 Posted: 2/7/2012 - 15:04

  • longbeach

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    The street walk from Siam BTS to MBK has great food. 99% thai customers which is a suprise. Most farangs go to MBK/Siam Paragon to eat.

    #27 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 04:40

  • longbeach

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    Trang night market, great food.

    Saw about 5-6 farangs in 4 days in that town low season. Saw none at the best cave in Thailand - Tham Lae Khao Kob

    #28 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 04:42

  • longbeach

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    #29 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 05:16

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
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    "I think the phrase "good street food" is oxymoronic"

    You can't be serious

    You don't like BBQ food and fruit?
    You don't like coconut sweets?
    You don't like fresh seafood cooked on the bbq?

    I've had more bad food in restaurants. So many "chefs" in restaurants serve up pretty ordinary thai food.

    It was funny in Nopphorat there's this big restaurant near the boat pier that charges 200 baht for dishes but the woman who rents a small space at the front and sells "street food" sells better food and it's 20-80 baht for freshly caught squid and fish. While across from her is a fruit shake stand 20-25 baht and the best coconut shakes i've had in a long time. Ao Nang restaurants charge 40-80 baht for worse drinks.

    #30 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 05:30

  • MADMAC

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    "You don't like BBQ food and fruit?"

    Nope, not a big BBQ fan.

    "You don't like coconut sweets?"

    They're OK. But my wife makes them better than I can buy at the night Market.

    "You don't like fresh seafood cooked on the bbq?"

    I don't like seafood at all - cooked on the BBQ or not.

    '"I think the phrase "good street food" is oxymoronic"

    You can't be serious'

    Completely serious. Perhaps because I eat it all the time and it's gotten old - way old. It's eadible, but not special. I would take a good old fashion Doenner Kebab or a McDonalds Cheeseburger any day of the week and twice on Sunday. Where I live we have neither. I get to eat "delicious Thai food" every day whether I want to or not. I go to the night market for dinner two to three times a week. I don't get the fascination with street food. Never will.

    "I've had more bad food in restaurants. So many "chefs" in restaurants serve up pretty ordinary thai food."

    I can't say I've had "more" bad food. I know which restaraunts serve food here I like, just as I know what stalls serve food I like. There is no doubt in my military mind that street food taken on the whole is a touch less hygenic - my wife and I have gotten sick more often from street food than from restaraunts and it stands to reason food being prepared in the open and subject to dust particles from traffic are more vulnerable to foreign invasion. But I don't think it's anything to get in a twist about. I eat it, so I'm obviously not overly concerned. But I certainly don't consider it a plus aspect of living here EXCEPT for the price. Which I admit is a big except.

    No question restaraunts are pricier, because you pay for ambience and comfort. Generally speaking, the better the ambience and comfort, the more you pay. Ain't rocket science or advanced economic theory.

    #31 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 06:27

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "I would take a good old fashion Doenner Kebab or a McDonalds Cheeseburger any day of the week and twice on Sunday."

    Pretty limited food tastes.

    I've eaten street food hundreds of times and never gotten sick. Been sick a few times from restaurants. BBQying food kills more bacteria than food which sits around in a restaurant for days.

    How could you not like seafood? Seriously what a loss. Get a tongue transplant.

    #32 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 09:33

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "No question restaraunts are pricier, because you pay for ambience and comfort"

    Usually uncomfortable plastic chairs, bad service and ordinary thai food. Can get better thai food from friends/relatives.

    The main reason I go to restaurants is to try unusual food like gop, wild boar, deer etc.

    #33 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 09:55

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    Longbeach - all street food is not BBQ. Most of it is stir fry. Come on man. how long have you been living here and you havne't noticed that?

    And while I would rather eat a good burger or Doenner (those being examples of non-Thai fast food) I love Somali food, Arabic food, Italian food, German food, Balkan food, etc. I've got reasonably wide ranging tastes. Thai food is on the OK list, not amongst my favorites.

    "I've eaten street food hundreds of times and never gotten sick. Been sick a few times from restaurants. BBQying food kills more bacteria than food which sits around in a restaurant for days."

    My wife and I have eaten it more than hundreds of times - we're well into the thousands. And we've cetainly gotten sick. But I only got real sick once. It's not a common occurrence.

    As for restaraunts - plastic chairs? You're talking cheapie restaraunts (although we do have one of those here in Muk which happens to have some very good food here - actually two). I was talking nice restaraunts. We on in particular on the river with fantastic food and great ambience and super service. Street food can't remotely compare with it. Of course it's about five times the price. Like I said, you get what you pay for. A universal truth in life.

    #34 Posted: 9/7/2012 - 22:21

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    'all street food is not BBQ. Most of it is stir fry. Come on man. how long have you been living here and you havne't noticed that?'
    Gai yang,pla yang, nam tok, som tam, kow man gai, various gaengs and on and on.
    Clearly you spend a lot of time in KSR where the only Thai food is pad thai=stir fry.
    Or maybe you're referring to pat pak?

    #35 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 00:00

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    Me on KSR? Look at the map Sayadian? Is Mukdahan close to KSR? You're killing me here. I hate KSR, as you well know.

    And I probably should have prefaced my comment with most cooked food is stir fry. Look, I am at the night market all the time... because it's cheap. Lots of good deals on food, CDs, but it ain't fine dining. People are just fooling themselves when they pretend it is.

    #36 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 01:59

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    'Look, I am at the night market all the time... because it's cheap. Lots of good deals on food.....but it ain't fine dining.'
    and 'Doenner Kebab or a McDonalds Cheeseburger.' are?

    #37 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 02:14

  • busylizzy

    Joined Travelfish
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    Location New Zealand
    Posts: 2088
    Total reviews: 20
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    At least 107

    I have eaten at many excellent local-style street carts, markets and small restaurants and never had a problem. For some unknown reason (possibly just for the aircon!), I was co-orced to go to a Pizza Hut n Bali the day before I headed home. 'Twas the only time I got sick - and within an hour of eating. Give me local food anyday!!

    #38 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 02:22

  • altmtl

    Click here to learn more about altmtl
    Joined Travelfish
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    Location Earth
    Posts: 832
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    "I would take a good old fashion McDonalds Cheeseburger any day of the week and twice on Sunday." - I would call that being a loser. I wouldn't touch McD food even if you paid me.

    #39 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 03:26

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "Longbeach - all street food is not BBQ. Most of it is stir fry. Come on man. how long have you been living here and you havne't noticed that?"

    Most of the meat is BBQ stuff - Sausages, seafood, kebabs then you have fried chicken and pork.

    You said you have only visited 1 beach location which means you haven't experience much of Thailand at all really. Go to the Trang night market or the night market at Nopphorat and then tell me the food is ordinary.

    I've never been to Mukdahan but there's some great street food around the country and if you rate plastic burgers from chains ahead of fresh seafood then you don't really know much about food at all.

    #40 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 06:39

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "Like I said, you get what you pay for. A universal truth in life."

    Not true. The most expensive restaurant I went to in Bangkok made me sick for 4 days. The best Thai food I've had has been home cooked, odd cheap places and night markets. Expensive places just make pretty plates and tables. Charging 400 baht for a massamun curry doesn't mean it's better. I had an awesome one the other week on a kayaking tour at a muslim owned resort for free as part of the day.

    The most expensive common raw items are produce like lobster, giant ocean crabs and wagyu beef and you don't like the first 2 and Thai beef is ordinary. You have to buy wagyu beef from Aust to get the real good stuff so I'm not sure why you are talking up expensive restaurants in Thailand for.

    #41 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 07:03

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    "Doenner Kebab or a McDonalds Cheeseburger.' are?"

    No, but they sure are tasty. That was my point. Fast food in Europe and the US isn't as varied as Thailand, but it sure tastes better. Street food is fast food here.

    "I was co-orced to go to a Pizza Hut n Bali the day before I headed home. 'Twas the only time I got sick - and within an hour of eating. Give me local food anyday!!"

    Well, we only have the Pizza company here. I've NEVER gotten sick from their food and never gotten sick from KFC. Those are my non-Thai choices here (besides the fusion food at Good Mook and the horrible burgers at "OK"). So not sure why you did. "Local" is not a synonym for good. Of that I am sure. Not for food or anything else. Not in the US, not in Germany and not in Thailand.

    "I would take a good old fashion McDonalds Cheeseburger any day of the week and twice on Sunday." - I would call that being a loser. I wouldn't touch McD food even if you paid me.

    Call it whatever you want - I'll call it tasty. Mcdonalds sells huge across the globe - there must be a reason. Perhaps not everyone is as sophisticated as you are altmtl.

    "You said you have only visited 1 beach location which means you haven't experience much of Thailand at all really. Go to the Trang night market or the night market at Nopphorat and then tell me the food is ordinary."

    I live in Thailand, and have for five years. But I am definitely an Issan guy. I don't like seafood. Never have, never will (OK I like Maine Lobster, but that's tough to get here). So to say I haven't experienced much of Thailand would be absurd. But I live in rural Thailand, not tourist Thailand (although Trat is also not tourist Thailand). Now my father in law hasn't spent hardly any time on the beach either, being that he's a rice farmer and the beach doesn't interest him much. Guess he hasn't experienced Thailand either.

    "I've never been to Mukdahan but there's some great street food around the country and if you rate plastic burgers from chains ahead of fresh seafood then you don't really know much about food at all."

    I know what I like and don't like. I don't like seafood - fresh or otherwise. So I would rate any chain food ahead of fresh seafood, since I don't like seafood. Don't be a moron. I already articulated that. Saying that if a person doesn't like seafood, therefore they know nothing about food is absurd. Street food isn't special. Not in Thailand, not in Germany, not in the US - not anywhere. It's just street food. In the tropics it tends to be more varied because the weather is more conducive to maintain an open air business. But it ain't fine dining and you'll never convince me it is.

    "Not true. The most expensive restaurant I went to in Bangkok made me sick for 4 days. The best Thai food I've had has been home cooked, odd cheap places and night markets. Expensive places just make pretty plates and tables. Charging 400 baht for a massamun curry doesn't mean it's better. I had an awesome one the other week on a kayaking tour at a muslim owned resort for free as part of the day."

    No it is true. You can find exceptions all day long. But if you think cheaper is better with food, or cars, or clothes, or anything else, you're just fooling yourself. We are talking principals here, vice individual experience on a day to day basis. Sure, my wife cooked me Schweinebraten last week that couldn't be beat, but that doesn't mean that I can't get a good Schweinebraten at a restaraunt in Germany. As a matter of fact, I had Penang Gai tonight at a river front restaraunt and it was excellent, and I had a nice view, with nice music and good service. I would have maybe gotten some good food, minus the rest, if I had gone to the night market.

    "The most expensive common raw items are produce like lobster, giant ocean crabs and wagyu beef and you don't like the first 2 and Thai beef is ordinary. You have to buy wagyu beef from Aust to get the real good stuff so I'm not sure why you are talking up expensive restaurants in Thailand for."

    Actually I do like lobster (but not how Thais prepare it. I like boiled lobster in butter) but that not withstanding a good restaraunt will have a good, school-trained chef, will get excellent quality base items to work with, will have a hygenic kitchen (note here I did say a GOOD restaraunt), good service and nice ambience. Those last two actually count for some people, which is why even Thai people go to restaraunts (if they didn't, there wouldn't be any). And remmember, expensive where I live is a relative thing. A meal with a beer here at an expensive restaraunt is five bucks.

    #42 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 09:17

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    That was a big post to say you like lobster and burgers. Each to their own but it's hard to give any food credibility to someone who rates cheap plastic burgers ahead of most seafood. Maccas sell a lot because it's fast and easy to buy not because it's high quality. Big Macs are horrible. What's in that special sauce? Over processed garbage.

    Justin Bieber sells a lot of music too. Using your logic that's great music :-)

    #43 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 09:35

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    I'm not a fan of the Big Mac myself - they're OK. I like the plain, old cheeseburgers. They are tasty!

    "Justin Bieber sells a lot of music too. Using your logic that's great music"

    And to Justin Bieber fans, it is! You see elitists like to create definitions around their own tastes, and then declare those who don't share those tastes with being pedestrian and uninformed.

    #44 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 09:53

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    Elitists? Not liking poor quality is not about being elite and you were the one bagging out street food as not being good :-)

    #45 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 10:20

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "And to Justin Bieber fans, it is!"

    Avg fan is 13yo and female.

    You value the music taste of 13yo girls who are clueless about life?

    #46 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 10:22

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    Hey, their tastes are just as valid as yours or mine. Obvsiouly I'm not a Justin Bieber fan, but I know a lot of people who think the Beatles sucked and others who think Janis Joplin was crap. I've met yet others who don't like classical music (minus Justin Bieber I like all of the above). But hey, if you think Justin is great, well, that's fine.

    As for food, though, I've been around. Having lived in a lot of different countries and eaten a lot of different food and Thai street food isn't even close to my number one choice (Somali food is followed closely by Italian food and German food). I absolutely don't get the fascination with it (other than it's cheap). Neither does my wife. She'll eat it, but she prefers German any day of the week. There is a place at the Khon Kaen night market, though, that sells these little sandwidches that taste just like a Saudi Shwarmi. Man, those are delicious. Can't get them in Muk though.

    #47 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 11:01

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    Italian food is very basic. I travelled all over Italy and I was disappointed with the food. You can get a better pizza outside of Italy and pasta is pasta yawn. I do like a good lasagna though.

    #48 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 18:03

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    I'm so happy! I've never heard of Justin Beiber.Can you eat him?

    #49 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 19:13

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "She'll eat it, but she prefers German any day of the week."

    Is that your opinion or hers?

    Apart from beer and sausages what's so great about German food? Thai Buddhists normally love pork so they would eat German pork sausages and pigs blood but you can get thai food like that on the street.

    You've got Black Forest cake but that's nothing special. French and Danish desserts are better.

    You can take a Thai out of Thailand for 10 yrs and they still prefer Thai food to euro food.

    You can get a Thai to like French or Italian food but they will always revert back to Thai food most of them time.

    Every Thai I know likes street food and isn't a big fan of Euro food despite being exposed to it many times.

    The easiest sell is salami and spicey sausages. Thais will like them but a lot of euro food they just won't get interested in.

    #50 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 22:11

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    "She'll eat it, but she prefers German any day of the week."

    Is that your opinion or hers?"

    OK, so I got my lazy ass off the computer and just asked her what her favorite types of food are in order: Greek, German, Japanese, Thai, Italian (though as I already knew, Schweinebraten is her singularly favorite meal). Then I asked her specifically "how would you rate street food, like from the night market". She made a face like she'd bitten into a lemon and said "It's cheap, but not very good."

    "You can take a Thai out of Thailand for 10 yrs and they still prefer Thai food to euro food."

    Not my wife. Maybe other Thais. Of her circle of friends I would say you are right about three of them that were our friends in Germany (Laila, Canun and Noi) and wrong about two (My wife and Dao). But do not confuse Thai food with street food. They ALL like good restaraunts - of that I can assure you.

    You can get a Thai to like French or Italian food but they will always revert back to Thai food most of them time.

    I certainly think that is true in a majority of the time. Most people, in fact, prefer their native cuisine in certain nostalgic ways. Remmember, most people don't belong to the backpacker set who think everything is "amazing" wherever they go. But my wife is an example where that doesn't hold true.

    "Every Thai I know likes street food and isn't a big fan of Euro food despite being exposed to it many times."

    My father in law won't touch anything that isn't Thai. Not even a remote consideration. He considers Vietnamese food disgusting. Pancakes for breakfast? Not happening. He is like most people on the planet in terms of how they regard foods. If you cooked him a Maine Lobster dipped in butter with nice bisquits on the side he wouldn't touch it. But this is in no way a reflection on lobster, is it?

    Street food is nothing special. Not anywhere in the world. It's common here because the weather is conducive to it's outdoor preparation, regulation of same is almost non-existent and it has historical tradition of being "normal". But it should not be mistaken for fine dining, which it is not.

    I'll tell you what I'll do, I'll take a poll amongst my Thai friends and ask them - if price were the same, would they prefer to eat at a nice restaraunt (say in Mukdahan Wine, Wild, Why or Nabop) or would they prefer to get their dinner at the night market. I can guarantee you what the outcome of that poll will be.

    #51 Posted: 10/7/2012 - 22:48

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    Who's paying?

    #52 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 01:02

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    Who's paying for what?

    #53 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 01:54

  • chinarocks

    Joined Travelfish
    17th June, 2011
    Posts: 684

    "Italian food is very basic. I travelled all over Italy and I was disappointed with the food. You can get a better pizza outside of Italy and pasta is pasta yawn. I do like a good lasagna though."

    Based on that comment alone, I sincerely doubt you've ever been to Italy, let alone travelled all over it. I've been to Italy a good few times and pizza, pasta and lasagne would not necessarily be high on any menu I've evr looked at, particularly not lasagne. Rather you get good seafood on the coast and things like Tuscan stews etc inland.

    However, on the occasions when I have tried pizza in Italy they have been exceptional. Likewise pasta (although typically it will come with something else).

    #54 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 02:57

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "Based on that comment alone, I sincerely doubt you've ever been to Italy, let alone travelled all over "

    Don't tell lies about me. I spent 3 weeks there and travelled around the country. Pizzas are very plain 1,2,3 toppings at most.

    Very basic, not my idea of a good pizza.

    #55 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:21

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "OK, so I got my lazy ass off the computer and just asked her what her favorite types of food are in order: Greek, German, Japanese, Thai, Italian (though as I already knew, Schweinebraten is her singularly favorite meal). "

    Thais normally hate lamb let alone rate Greek food above Thai food. I think you're making this stuff up because you're bored or your wife is very unusual for a Thai.
    I don't need to ask my wife what she likes because I already know.

    Or perhaps the Thai food out there is like dog food literally like the town up the road which is famous for it.

    #56 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:24

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "Rather you get good seafood on the coast and things like Tuscan stews etc inland."

    That's the case around the world.

    I'd rather make my own lasagna.

    The best food in Italy for mine was gelato. None of the mains did it for me.

    #57 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:27

  • chinarocks

    Joined Travelfish
    17th June, 2011
    Posts: 684

    longbeach - if you don't like Italian food you would be in a global minority.

    Of all the places I've travelled, the best food would be in China, Vietnam, France, Italy and Argentina.

    #58 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:32

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "Schweinebraten"

    Thais have their own version of slow roasted pork and eat loads of different dishes. Don't know about this single fav idea.

    #59 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:37

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "longbeach - if you don't like Italian food you would be in a global minority."

    I do like it if it's cooked right. Unfortunately Ital restaurants are a dime a dozen and most ho hum.

    Pasta itself is boring. You need the garlic, basil and sauce flavour with good quality meat to make the food.

    I grow 3 types of basil in the backyard so Ita restaurants do dont it for me when I can cook it myself.

    #60 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 04:40

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    "Don't tell lies about me. I spent 3 weeks there and travelled around the country. Pizzas are very plain 1,2,3 toppings at most.

    Very basic, not my idea of a good pizza."

    This is why you probably like Thai food so much. Thai food tends to mix a lot of different things together in preparation. That's a style of food I don't particularly like, but a style that some gravitate to. I like plain cheese Pizza. If I have a topping on it, I want salami. That's it.

    "Thais normally hate lamb let alone rate Greek food above Thai food. I think you're making this stuff up because you're bored or your wife is very unusual for a Thai."

    My wife is certainly unusual for a Thai, as she live in Germany for 12 years. Greek is very popular in Germany (not as much with me - it's OK). So she developed tastes that Thais in Thailand most certainly would not. And I asked her to be precise. I know most of what she likes since we've been together for 12 years.

    "Or perhaps the Thai food out there is like dog food literally like the town up the road which is famous for it."

    Dog ain't on the menu, but people here do eat dog. No question about it. I've never had it though. But it's not sold at the market.

    "Schweinebraten"

    Thais have their own version of slow roasted pork and eat loads of different dishes. Don't know about this single fav idea."

    Don't talk out your ass man, Thais have nothing remotely resembling a Schweinebraten. They don't do sauces like that and they don't do dumplings that go with them either. There is nothing remotely comparable in the Thai culinary tradition.

    "longbeach - if you don't like Italian food you would be in a global minority."

    I do like it if it's cooked right. Unfortunately Ital restaurants are a dime a dozen and most ho hum."

    This opinion is clearly a minority opinion. The reason they are common is because people like them. We have one in Ubon Ratchathani that we love (but it's far enough away, we don't get there much). Italian is excellent. Maybe YOU think it's pedestrian, and that's OK, but most people would strongly disagree with you here.

    "Pasta itself is boring. You need the garlic, basil and sauce flavour with good quality meat to make the food."

    Sure. Rice is boring. Pasta is a base. Come on now, you're talking foolish here.

    "I grow 3 types of basil in the backyard so Ita restaurants do dont it for me when I can cook it myself."

    Again, you are not an example of the rest of the world.

    As for Thai street food, I reiterate as street food goes it is more variable here than most places, but it is does not taste better unless you happen to have a thing for Thai food in particular. Just as I prefer German food, hence German street food tastes better to me.

    #61 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 05:12

  • Nokka

    Joined Travelfish
    6th April, 2009
    Location United Kingdom
    Posts: 259

    In my view it takes a rare skill to travel around Italy for 3 weeks and not eat well. I love Italy and have travelled there many times - the food is possibly my favourite in the world. Generally Italians use superb produce, so even relatively simple dishes are delicious. Planning where to eat is part of the joy of travel for me - to just fall into any old tourist restaurant has no interest to me, you're just asking for poor quality. That's the case anywhere in the world - Italy, Thailand or in your own hometown.

    #62 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 06:28

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    And I should add that in Milano I had a Spagetti Amatriciana that could not be beat. And it was about 5 Euro, which was a good deal. I paid considerably more when I had the same thing (not quite as tasty) in Bangkok! I like Italian a lot. One of those foods I could eat just about every day. Unfortunately for me, Thai is the food I am eating just about every day.

    #63 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 06:48

  • billytheliar

    Joined Travelfish
    3rd April, 2012
    Posts: 38
    Total reviews: 7
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    At least 19

    Maybe it's time for a decisive turn in this thread : How about discussing colours? (I actually find grey superb).
    Madmac, if you ever come to Athens, Greece, I'll have my mother-in-law cook for you and your wife - if you promise not to start a discussion about firearms.

    #64 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 06:49

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    Billy we have a deal!

    Your mom like a firearms collector or something?

    #65 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 06:53

  • billytheliar

    Joined Travelfish
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    Posts: 38
    Total reviews: 7
    Places visited:
    At least 19

    She just is so peaceful, it gets boring even for me.

    #66 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 06:57

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "In my view it takes a rare skill to travel around Italy for 3 weeks and not eat well"

    Sydney has better Italian restaurants. Even Italians agree with me on that.

    #67 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 07:10

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    [li]2 – 3 pound pork loin roast[/li][li]4 slices pork bacon[/li][li]2 cloves garlic, chopped[/li][li]salt and pepper[/li][li]1 large onion[/li][li]1 cup carrot slices[/li][li]2 c. white wine (substitute water, beer or broth if desired)[/li][li]caraway seeds[/li][li]2 tsp. cornstarch[/li][li]1 vegetable bouillon cube[/li][li]olive, canola, or almond oil[/li][li]1 apple (or 1/4 c. apple juice)[/li][li]1 tbsp. sour cream, optional[/li]another one, nothing special about this dish.

    Polish roast duck is better than this.

    #68 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 07:14

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    German recipe
    4 -6 lbs pork shoulder or 4 -6 lbs pork butt 2 tablespoons caraway seeds 1 tablespoon salt 2 teaspoons ground pepper 2 tablespoons cooking oil 3 medium onions, roughly chopped 2 carrots, peeled and chopped 1/2 cup water or 1/2 cup stock or 1/2 cup white wine or 1/2 cup beer 2 -3 tablespoons flour 2 -3 tablespoons butter Other seasonings that can be rubbed into the pork before roasting includemarjoram or minced garlic or your favorite mustard


    That's quiet a boring dish really.

    I've done chinese and french style dishes that had more ingredients

    #69 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 07:35

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    "avoid Siam Square area if avoiding tourists in Bangkok"

    MBK has free Muay Thai (good std too) on wednesday nights. They stop for 2 mths during low season. Some of the best street food is near there too. The best money exchange in Bkk that i've found is there too - siam exchange which offered rates 0.35 baht higher than super rich.

    Avoiding lame touristy things is one thing, avoiding all tourists for the sake of it is just dumb.

    #70 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 09:01

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    "That's quiet a boring dish really."

    You remind me of Faulkner when he criticized Hemingway with the following:

    β€œHe has never been known to use a word that might send a reader to the dictionary.”

    Hemingway responded:

    "Poor Faulkner, he really thinks big emotions come from big words?"

    Poor Longbeach, you really think tasty food comes from lots of ingredients? Anyone who has dined on a quality Schweinebraten mit Speatzle or Knoedel knows it can't be beat. My wife belongs to that group. Maybe you just haven't actually eaten it yet.

    #71 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 11:30

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    Roast pork with dumplings can't be beat? I almost feel sorry for you. You're the guy who rates plastic burgers above seafood so when it comes to food I can't you seriously. The French have many dishes with more flavour than that. German food isn't that liked around the world because it's really not that good. And claiming your wife rates it as proof of anything is neither here nor there. So 1 odd Thai women in Mukdahan and 1 old German guy love 1 dish. Big whoop. We like icecream on toast, therefore it must be world class :-)

    #72 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 18:53

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    Is there a recipe thread on this site?

    #73 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 19:35

  • longbeach

    Joined Travelfish
    28th March, 2012
    Posts: 307

    should there be? there's a million recipes on the net. makes me wonder why people still buy recipe books

    #74 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 19:36

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    Take a look at the way the thread is going and you'll see what I mean.
    Anyway, I though Germans lived on sausages.

    #75 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 20:55

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    I'm not German. I lived in Germany for 18 years, but I am not German.

    "Roast pork with dumplings can't be beat? I almost feel sorry for you. "

    We have no equivelent in American cuisine either. Nor do the British. I've eaten their food plenty. In short, nobody else makes this. It's a Germanic food all the way. The key is in the sauce. The meat is also extemely tender when properly prepared. It's a fantastic meal, and I don't know anyone who has eaten it who doesn't agree.

    #76 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 23:04

  • sayadian

    Joined Travelfish
    15th January, 2008
    Posts: 1557

    Russian is good-can't beat a good Borsch.
    'I've eaten their food plenty'
    I think UK has more international food than most places now seeing as we take everybody from everywhere.
    We even have MacDonalds; so you'll be at home.
    So you've tried Haggis, Cawl? That's British.

    #77 Posted: 11/7/2012 - 23:18

  • MADMAC

    Joined Travelfish
    6th June, 2009
    Posts: 6332
    Total reviews: 10

    'I've eaten their food plenty'
    I think UK has more international food than most places now seeing as we take everybody from everywhere."

    I'm sure. Although German I imagine would be low on the list. BUT, I am saying that you don't have the equivelent in British food (like we don't in the states).

    #78 Posted: 12/7/2012 - 13:07

  • daawgon

    Joined Travelfish
    17th April, 2007
    Posts: 936
    Total reviews: 2

    Here's another link to the Sao Chingcha food map in Bangkok

    thank you, Tilapia!

    #79 Posted: 20/7/2012 - 22:35

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